Rogue Review

[Aviendha]

The review is well underway and we wanted to share a sort of first glimpse into the changes being made for the rogue talent review. Keep in mind that these changes are not complete or final, and the below information is likely to alter as we move into our testing phases. While not everything is listed, the below list encompasses the majority of changes being made in the review.

I'll be working in the weeks to come to get as much additional information as possible, but it is likely that quite a bit of the final information regarding talent changes will not be fully announced until the talent calculators go live. Of course you'll also be able to actually play around with the changes too once the Public Test Realms go up.

I'm going to just list the changes and provide additional information where possible or necessary. Let's get to it.

# The following talents have been removed: Improved Deadly Poison, Improved Distract, Throwing Weapon Specialization, Improved Vanish, and Rapid Concealment.

# Improved Instant Poison is now "Improved Poisons" and increases your chance to apply ALL poisons by 2/4/6/8/10%.

# Rapid Concealment has been merged with Camouflage, by combining these talents you not only get a great talent to start off the tree, but obviously it frees up a number of points to be spent elsewhere.

# Murder will now also apply to all finishing moves. The benefit this will provide to output and attack combinations is fairly straightforward.

# Vile Poisons now gives your poisons a chance to resist dispel effects, in addition to increasing poison damage.

# Improved Kidney Shot has been changed, and will instead increase the damage taken by the target while they are affected by Kidney Shot. This talent no longer reduces the cooldown of Kidney Shot.

# Improved Sprint has been changed, and will instead have a 50/100% chance to remove all movement impairing effects when you activate your Sprint ability. This talent no longer reduces the cooldown of Sprint.

# Improved Evasion renamed to Endurance, and will add a Sprint cooldown reduction.

# New talent Weapon Expertise in the Combat tree, increases your weapon skill with all melee weapons. The recovery of damage with an increased weapon skill should be a good boost to overall output.

# Initiative is being reduced to a 3 point talent, but resulting in the same 75% end chance to add an additional combo point.

# Elusiveness is being reduced to a 3 point talent, but resulting in the same 75 sec cooldown reduction to Evasion, Blind, and Vanish.

# Ghostly Strike now has a reduced Energy cost, the reduction of Energy was enough to make it necessary to also reduce the damage output slightly.

# Improved Garrotes damage reduction will be removed. This is being changed as part of an overall improvement for Garrote.

# Setup is being moved higher up in the tree, becoming a 16 point talent with no prerequisites, helping move the talent in reach of specific builds.

# New talent Heightened Senses in the subtlety tree, increases your Stealth detection, and reduces the chance for you to be hit by spells and ranged attacks.

# Hemorrhage will be moved up in the tree to become a 21 point talent. This should help to place the ability in a more reachable position, and allow for a little more versatility with specific talent builds.

# New talent Deadliness in the Subtlety tree, increases your Attack Power by a percentage.

# Premeditation will have its Energy requirement removed, changed to an instant cast, and range increased. Its cooldown will remain the same. Premeditation will now be pre-reqd by Preperation.

# Vanish will now remove effects that allow the caster to remain aware of the rogues presence, such as Mind Vision and Hunters Mark.
(emphasis by me, obviously)

# Garrote, Rupture, and Eviscerate are being increased in damage. More details to come.

# Expose Armor will now reduce armor by a percentage.

I'll be continuing to speak with the designers and collecting as much additional information as possible in the coming weeks.

Thanks for reading.



Hört sich eigentlich sehr schick an.
Mal sehen obs auch dann so ist wie es sich anhört

[madtom]

Also weapon expertise wenns halbwegs sinnvolle werte liefert wird irre viel bringen auf raids. Weniger Glanzing blows, also deutlich mehr normalen Dmg bei 63er mobs.
Deadliness klingt auch nett.

[Pullox]

Sehr interessante und teilweise vor allem unerwartete Änderungen, allerdings isses wie gesagt nur ein "first glimpse" also muss man noch warten wie das ganze mit den Talent Trees aussieht wenn es fertig ist.

Was auch super ist und nicht aufgeführt ist, dass "Expose Armor" nun mit "Sunder Armor" stacked. Drum haben sie es auch auf %-Werte geändert nehm ich mal an.

Vor allem die enorme (und auch notwendige) Überarbeitung des "Subtlety"-Trees gefällt mir. Sind ein paar extrem nette Dinge dazu gekommen bzw. zum Besseren geändert worden.

Leider sind viele der Changes die hier angegeben wurden primär enorme PvP improvements (zb. Imp. Sprint, Vanish). Deshalb muss man erstmal warten bis mehr Details bekannt werden und man auch die Talentverteilung in den Bäumen sieht um absehen zu können wieviele Änderungen fürs PvE dazu kommen.
Aber es ist mal ein solider Anfang. Bin schon im positiven Sinn auf mehr gespannt.

MfG

[Dokk]

Ok, jetzt kommt der Rogue also nicht nur mit Vanish, sondern auch mit Sprint aus den Roots, die in der Regel eh keine 5 Sekunden halten. Hat sich der Dr00d im PvP dann auch erledigt. Sorry für den Whine .

@ Merrie
Kann nicht sein, die Aged Core Leather Gloves werden doch jedes mal gebröselt

[Pullox]

@Dokk: Nein, Imp. Sprint hebt Effekte auf die dich langsamer laufen lassen, nicht welche die dich wo festnageln. Also aus Frostnova oder Root sollte man damit nicht rauskommen so wie ich es verstanden habe.
Harmstring, der Snare Schuss von den Huntern, Frostbolt snare usw sollte damit aufgehoben werden können. Allerdings auch nur im Moment wo dus anwirfst. Also wennst 1sec danach wieder einen Snare bekommst is der ganze Zauber wieder zu Ende.

MfG

[Dokk]

Würde ich nicht drauf wetten, Diri. "Movement impairing" bedeutet in der Regel Roots & Snares.

Beispiel: BoF

[Mallfin]

Wenn die PvP Änderungen in der Form kommen wirds in BGs zu 80% Rogues geben.
Kein Hunters Mark mehr, kein Kiten mehr - juchee! Sollte der Rogue meine Falle zuvor nicht schon entschärft haben, kann ich nur noch auf einen 3k Aimed Shot crit hoffen. Wobei...dann fallen die meisten auch noch nicht um. Dann steht er nämlich bei mir und haut mich mit Imp. Kidney Shot im Stunlock um.

/end whining

[madtom]

Übertreibts net selbst wenn er einmal imp. sprint used hat er dann cooldown und ist normal wieder snarebar.

[Aviendha]

Momentan sind Rogues Autokills für Jäger, das kanns auch nicht sein.
Und die BGs bestehen eh schon zu 80% aus Kriegern, Jaegern und Schurken

[Thuloom]

Naja als Hunter hatte man bisher halt nur das Prob den Rogue das erste mal zu finden ... Bisher war ich durchschnitlich auf 20-40% bevor ich einmal in annehmbarer Schußdistanz war ... So wie ich die Änderungen verstehe macht der Rogue in Zukunft einfach nen Vanish und nen Sprint, ist wieder unsichtbar bei mir weil sowohl Hunters Mark als auch Snare weg sind und ich bin tot ...
Besser ausgerüßtete Rogues killen mich bevor ich auch nur einen Schuß abgegeben habe, wobei ich die meißte Zeit gestuned oder Blind in der Gegend stehe/im Kreis laufe und das schon ohne die Änderungen ...

Edit:
BTW schön das der Sprint nen Cooldown hat, aber diesen kann er auch verkürzen ... Und nen Gegner den ich nicht sehe kann ich nicht Snaren, abgesehen davon das der Snareschuß auch nen nicht gerade kurzen Cooldown hat und ich einen 2. Nahkampf ehr nicht überlebe

Edit2:
Wobei meine schlechten Erfahrungen auch durchaus durch meine Skillung begünstigt ist ... Aber die Diskussion wenn ich noch 20% weniger Damage mache nur um im PvP nicht ganz alt auszusehen tu ich mir (noch) nicht an ...

[Ahlanah]

das hunters marks ist nicht das problem 1 vs 1, es ist eigendlich ausschliesslich laestig, wenn man nicht stirbt als rogue, da man dann mit der vollkommenen absurditaet eines pfeils ueberm kopf die naechsten 3 minuten herumrennt. da in einer pickup das mark zu 99% nicht dispelled wird, lass ich mich meistens irgendwann umhauen, weils mir die zeit danach, in der ich als rogue eigendlich nichts sinnvolles machen kann, nicht wert ist.

christian

[Aviendha]

We have been continuing to work on the review since the 'First Glimpse' post, the talent calculator unveiling, and we have been building upon those initial changes. After our own discussions and testing, as well as reviewing the player feedback we have received, we are planning to make the below additional changes to the rogue talents for patch 1.12.

Please keep in mind that these changes, as well as the review as a whole, are not final, and are still subject to change. We are moving closer to the launch of the Public Test Realms for 1.12 and we will be continuing to evaluate the changes throughout the testing process.

The 'First Glimpse' post and talent calculator can be viewed from the links below.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... 271292&p=1

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/cla ... lents.html


# Murder has been changed to increase damage caused against Humanoid, Giant, Beast, and Dragonkin by 1%/2%.

# Remorseless Attacks has been reduced to 2 ranks, with the new effectiveness being 20% and 40%.

# Endurance has been changed to reduce the cooldown of your Sprint and Evasion abilities by 45 sec/1.5 min. It no longer increases the duration of Evasion.

# Weapon Expertise will now increases your skill with Fist, Dagger, and Sword weapons. It will no longer affect Maces, and this change is being followed up by

# Mace Specialization will now also add 1-5 weapon skill with Maces, in addition to the stun effect the talent already provides.

# Adrenaline Rush now has a reduced cooldown of 5 min.

# Elusiveness has been reduced to a 2 point talent and now reduces the cooldown of Vanish and Blind by 45 sec/1.5 min. It no longer reduces the cooldown for Evasion.

# Opportunity is being moved to a tier 1 talent, swapping places with Camouflage.

# Ghostly Strike has been reverted back to the previous 125% weapon damage, but retains its new Energy cost of 40.

# Setup will now also provide combo points if you fully resist an attackers spell.

# Improved Rupture, Improved Cheap Shot, and Improved Garrote have been removed.

# New talent 'Serrated Blades' is a tier 4 talent in the Subtlety tree, causes your attacks to ignore X of your targets Armor, and increases the damage dealt by your Rupture ability. The amount of Armor reduced increases with your level. At level 60, the ranks will reduce target Armor by 100/200/300 respectively.

# New talent 'Dirty Deeds' replaces the Improved Cheap Shot talent, reducing the Energy cost of both the Cheap Shot and Garrote abilities by 10/20.

# Garrote, Eviscerate, and Rupture now all scale with Attack Power. The previously announced Eviscerate book will still be made available in an undisclosed location. While we had always planned to scale these abilites at a point in the future, we felt that the rank upgrade for Eviscerate and damage increase for Garotte would provide a well needed boost in the current game and carry these abilities until the scaling mechanic was implemented. Our ultimate goal to scale the abilities in a future update was decided to be moved ahead, and the current plan is to implement scaling for these abilities in 1.12, instead of in a later update.


Again, please keep in mind that any of the above changes are subject to revision, reversal, or removal. We'll be continuing to evaluate these changes, and the review as a whole. Neither the talent calculator, nor these forum posts should be considered final word on the review.

Thanks for reading.



Wow haben endlich mal auf die Community gehört, das hört sich schonmal wesentlich besser an als die ersten changes.

[madtom]

Below are the current values that we are currently working with for the scaling of Garrote, Eviscerate, and Rupture with Attack Power. As with everything in the review, these are subject to change.

The original thread detailing the most recent changes announced for the review can be found here: https://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thre ... &t=1337254

Garrote 6:
Old Damage: 432
600 AP: 660
800 AP:696
1500 AP: 822
% Increase for 1500 AP: 90%

Eviscerate 8:
Old Damage: 936
600 AP: 941
800 AP: 971
1500 AP: 1076

Eviscerate 9:
600 AP: 1048
800 AP: 1078
1500 AP: 1183
% Increase for 1500 AP: 26%

Rupture 6:
Old Damage: 935
600 AP: 944
800 AP: 992
1500 AP: 1160
% Increase for 1500 AP: 24%