Upcoming Changes....

[Chili]

Einiges hiervon unterliegt zwar noch Changes, aber die Richtung klingt doch mal ganz gut, alles geplqant fuer den 16ten Dezember:

BARDS
Hello Norrath,

In the next update, tentatively scheduled for December 16th, any bards who have used AA points to purchase either Extended Notes 3 or Sionachie's Crescendo will have those abilities removed and the AA points reimbursed. <P>The abilities are being changed so that they only affect beneficial songs and chants. The use of these abilities on some AOE and damage songs or Chants was overbalancing, which made this change necessary. <P>Please be aware that you will be receiving a refund of these AA points and that you cannot save more than 30 points. So if your refund brings you over 30, you will need to spend them before you zone after the update.


ROGUES
There hasn’t been a lot of information going out about the new disciplines
setup so I thought I’d drop by and give you all a basic breakdown on them. FYI, I'm Ryan Barker for those of you that don't know. If you've been in one of the expansion betas in the last couple years (or played on Tallon Zek summer of '01) you know me as Rytan.

Timer 1
Counter Attack – Level 53 – 45 minute reuse
Nimble – Level 55 – 21 minute reuse

Timer 2
Kinesthetics – Level 57 – 22.8 minute reuse
Duelist – Level 59 – 24.6 minute reuse
Twisted Chance – Level 65 – 30 minute reuse

Timer 3
Deadeye – Level 54 – 21.1 minute reuse
Blinding Speed – Level 58 – 22.8 minute reuse
Deadly Precision – Level 63 – 30 minute reuse
Weapon Affinity – Level 61 – 30 minute reuse

Timer 4
Fearless – Level 40 – 1800 second reuse
Resistant – Level 30 – 1800 second reuse
Healing Will – Level 63 – 300 second reuse

All of the disciplines will function as they currently do on live, with the
exception of an increase in the potency of the resistant discipline.
Here is an explanation of the new disciplines:
Weapon Affinity – Increases your proc rate for 24 seconds
Twisted Chance – Makes every attack hit, critical, double attack, dual wield for 12 seconds
Deadly Precision – Every backstab lands for 30 seconds.
When a discipline is used, any discipline on the same timer will not be
usable until the reuse time for the used discipline has expired. I.E using

Kinesthetics will gray out duelist and twisted chance for 22.8 minutes. During that time you can if you so choose use any of the other disciplines on the other
timers, provided you have enough endurance.
If anyone has feedback on this setup I’d love to hear it.
- Ryan

MONKS
Phantom Wind line
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've seen several posts on this topic wondering what's going on with the new abilities on test and I thought I'd clear up some confusion on the new phantom wind line.

FYI, I'm Ryan Barker for those of you that don't know. If you've been in one of the expansion betas in the last couple years (or played on Tallon Zek summer of '01) you know me as Rytan.

The plane for Phantom Wind is to give monks a tool to speed up pulling in group situations. To that end, the tentative line up of abilities is as follows:

Phantom Zephyr - Level 35 - Level 50 Lull cap
Phantom Wind - Level 50 - Level 58 Lull Cap
Phantom Echo - Level 57 - Level 61 Lull Cap
Phantom Call - Level 64 - Level 65 Lull Cap

As with the provoke line the endurance cost is still up in the air, so I won't comment on that right now.

The range is tentatively changing to 150, to address the concerns of many NPCs having a larger aggro radius then 100.

Again, the goal of this new ability is to speed up pulling in areas with lots of low to equal level mobs that are often difficult to split using tradition FD techniques. In addition, multiple monks should be able to split larger sized rooms, so that should add a bit of stackability as well. (I know the generally it's not needed, but I thought I'd mention it all the same.)

If anyone has any feedback on this or any other aspect of the new melee system I'd love to hear it. I posted my E-mail address on the Steel Warrior board, but I think it would be more productive if the bulk of the feedback went here in the thread where everyone can discuss it. Altough, If anyone has anything they really want to send me feel free.

-Ryan

Discipline Timers
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Edited 12/11 8 PM
-Changed reuse timers to be in minutes
-Update all disciplines to their level 65 reuse times
-Added descriptions of the new disciplines


Everyone seems confused on this so I thought I'd post a break down for you. This is all subject to change of course before going live.

Timer 1
Stone Stance - Level 51 - 3.9 minute reuse
Whirlwind - Level 53 - 49.2 minute reuse
Voiddance - Level 54 - 50.1 minute reuse
Earthwalk - Level 65 - 3.9 minute reuse

Timer 2
Inner Flame - Level 56 - 21.9 minute reuse
Hundred Fists - Level 57 - 22.8 minute reuse
Speed Focus - Level 63 - 22.8 minute reuse

Timer 3 (Thunderkick and Silentfist will likely be changed to be longer as they now have a duration instead of lasing one event)
Thunderkick - Level 52 - 4 minute reuse
Silentfist - Level 59 - 4.5 minute reuse
Ashenhand - Level 60 - 67.5 minute reuse
Planeswalk - Level 61 - 30 minute reuse

Timer 4
Fearless – Level 40 – 37.5 minute reuse
Resistant – Level 30 – 28.5 minute reuse
Healing Will – Level 63 – 5 minute reuse

Here's a breakdown of the new 60 disciplines:
Earthwalk - Same as Stonestance stun immunity
Speed Focus - 100 hands upgrade, increase your melee speed independent of haste effects.
Planeswalk - Increase run speed
Healing will - 100 hp/tick heal

When a discipline is used, any discipline on the same timer will not be usable until the reuse time for the used discipline has expired. I.E using Stone Stance will gray out Whirlwind, Voidance, and Earthwalk for 3.9 minutes. During that time you can if you so choose use any of the other disciplines on the other timers, provided you have enough endurance.

Again, feedback is welcome on any of this.
-Ryan

WARRIORS

Just as an FYI, I'm Ryan Barker, one of the Dev's working on the new Melee
system. Those of you that have been in recent Betas know me as Rytan.
As I'm sure you've all noticed, we're still making lots of changes to the
system before it goes live. Based on the testing and great feedback we've gotten from a number of people we're looking at making the Provoke line up look something like this:

Provoke - Level 20, 100Hate, 40Hate/Tick, 500 Total Hate
Bellow - Level 45, 200 Hate, 50Hate/Tick, 700 Total Hate
Berate - Level 56, 300 Hate, 60Hate/Tick, 900 Total Hate
Belittle - Level 63, 400 Hate, 70 Hate/Tick, 1100 Total Hate

I'm hesitant to post endurance cost numbers at this point because we're still monkeying with the formula quite a bit, and it will likely change a lot before it goes live. It should work out to being available once per NPC depending on the speed at which you pull.

In regards to the range, I don't plan on increasing the range past 100. This
is not designed as a pulling tool, but rather an ability that gives warriors a
way to pull immediate aggro when a mob enters camp. It's not going to let
everyone cast their biggest spells with impunity, but it should shorten the
window that casters will still pull aggro with an early debuff or nuke.

I'm interested in you feedback on this, or any other aspect of the melee
system you have a chance to test.   rbarker@soe.sony.com if you have a
chance to write out your thoughts and observations, or you can always post here.
I'm keeping up on most of the threads regarding the changes.

Thanks,
-Ryan

Im Steelwarrior Forum sagte Ryan dann noch das die Reuse Time wohl bei ca. 30 Sec liegen wird.

[Minyatur Laurelin]

ich kann nur sagen ... einfach nur genial

Muss mir gleich mal überlegen wie ich das Discipline Hotkeyset anlege, planeswalk, earthwalk und healing will in Verbindung mit der Lull linie und Rapid FD ... einfach nur grenzgenial für Named pulls

Sieht wirklich so aus als ob wir Monks wieder die Nummer 1 Puller werden (oder zumindest nicht mehr hinten nach hängen )

Ich freu mich

PS: Tanjara, mach dich schon mal bereit mir nen crashkurs in Lull Pulling zu geben

cu,

[Aviendha]

Jo schaut gut aus, wurde auch langsam Zeit.

@Miny
Regel1: Pull nie den mob den du lulled hast *G

[Chili]

New Discipline System
Here's the way we have the disciplines set up right now. Most of them are using the level 65 reuse time or something close to it. We're obviously still tuning things, so this list isn't set in stone. We'd like to get as much feedback as possible, though, so any and all comments are welcome.

Timer 1
Evasive - Level 52 - 30 ticks - 10.5 minute reuse
Defensive - Level 55 - 30 ticks - 10.5 minute reuse
Stonewall - Level 65 - 30 ticks - 10.5 minute reuse

Timer 2
Furious - Level 56 - 2 ticks - 45 minute reuse
Fellstrike - Level 58 - 2 ticks - 25 minute reuse
Fortitude - Level 59 - 2 ticks - 45 minute reuse

Timer 3
Charge - Level 53 - 3 ticks - 20 minute reuse
Mighty Strike - Level 54 - 2 ticks - 30 minute reuse
Precision - Level 57 - 30 ticks - 23 minute reuse
Aggressive - Level 60 - 30 ticks - 23 minute reuse
Spirit of Rage - Level 61 - 2 ticks - 30 minute reuse

Timer 4
Resistant - Level 30 - 50 ticks - 30 minute reuse
Fearless - Level 40 - 10 ticks - 30 minute reuse
Healing Will - Level 63 - 5 ticks - 5 minute reuse

You can't use another discipline on the same timer until the first recharge timer is up. If you use Resistant, you won't be able to use Healing Will for 30 minutes.

We'll post endurance upkeep costs when they're tuned a little more, along with the level 63 discipline.

When it comes to the short disciplines, remember that they will last the remaining duration of the current tick plus the listed duration. A 2-tick discipline can last from 12.1 to 17.9 seconds depending on the timing.

- Kavhok, SOE

Spirit of Rage increases your Agro Multiplyer by 50% (meaning you do 1.5 as much agro as before...). From what Frodlin and others say, this stacks with the Voice line from SKs (max 12%...probably the Visage line from Enchanters too, max 10%) and the Time BP for warriors (15%). It affects increases the amount of agro you generate during that time...50% is huge, IMO. Apparently it affects Provoke as well.

Healing will is a 100hp/tick for 5 ticks regen with a 5minute re-use. Not bad for an occasional boost to top you off.

Stonewall is the same as Defensive, same duration and re-use. The difference is instead of lowering the amount of damage you do as a balance, it snares you instead. (You become like stone...stone isn't very mobile on it's own, you know ) So you get the defensive ability, and you can still do your normal damage, but you can't move around easily...but hey, if you decide to corner the mob, you aren't moving anyways.
__________________
Solving the problems of the world, one paladin death at a time!

[Chili]

Ein Zitat aus dem Steelwarrior-Forum, scheinbar kennen auch andere Gilden Extreme-fast-Debuffers-while-still-pulling....

Thanks a lot... Yeah, that works out well. Spirit of Rage and Stonewall, I mean, I can't see using Healing Will at my level of play, but I can definately see it being usefull to non-raiding warriors.

Stonewall seems awesome, if you are in a situation where ping-pong won't be a factor. I could see this killing a shammy who decided to cast slow from halfway across the zone in an exp group setting. And that may not even be a factor with Belittle. But it will only kill stupid/careless slowers (IE, someone casting slow on incoming on a mob that NEEDS Stonewall), and quite frankly, I'd rather get a DPS then a stupid/careless slower.

Rage could so be overpowered if it wasn't such a short disc... with it affecting the Provoke line, it should be very usefull on raid level mobs, as well as a miniboss in an xp group. I would almost suggest a longer duration at the expense of less of a % upgrade, to give more of a chance of an aggro proc... But with the provoke line basically garunteeing an aggro proc, I can see the uses.

Healing Will would be great on a 5k warrior farming Kael for Armor, for example. I don't see it helping a 9k warrior xping in Elementals, but not all discs need to be aimed at the higher level warriors.

In short... I think this could be a really good job, Rytan and the Rest. I have to say, assuming this work as I seem to think they will, Good Job.

[Chili]

Noch ein Hinweis:

Angeblich wurde Resistant-Disci (bei allen Klassen die sie haben) auf Duration 5 mins und 20 auf alle resis erhöht.
Duration ist gut, 20 als Wert ist eher ein bischen wenig....

[Chili]

Und noch einer:

Ein EQ Developer im Steelwarrior Forum zum Thema Fear/stuns-Spells Agro.. (Snare fand keine Erwähnung, scheinbar (ich bin da kein Spezialist) machen die meisten SKs Agro mit fear spells.... Auch Furor der wohl inzwischen zu gleichen Teilen einen Palla, einen SK und seinen Warrior nur mehr selten spielt sagte das er für solid agro generation in Gruppen und Raids nur mehr low level fear nutzt. Ich wage Furors Post zu dem Thema hier nicht zu wiederholen, den wie bei Furor üblich müsste ich dann einen Adult check einführen )

We've known for quite a while how much hate is generated by all kinds of spell effects. Figuring out the best course of action is much trickier than simply looking up numbers in code or debugging NPCs. Nothing will be changing with this patch, for sure.

Allerdings wurde an anderer Stelle erwähnt das bei Immunity die Spell agro wohl auf 0 reduziert wird. Ein wenig widersprüchlich....

[Chili]

Ich kann nicht anders, möchte vorwegnehmen das ich nicht allem zustimme was Furor sagt, aber ich finds immer wieder schön wie sich Furor in Rage reden kann.
Der Thread wurde von einem armen Palladin gestartet der im wesentlichen meinte das mit den Changes die Warrior overpowered sein nun. Man beachte das Wort "kindly" in seiner Verabschiedung!
Nochmals ich poste das nicht wegen des sachlichen Inhalts sondern weil Furors Postings einer gewissen Komik nicht entbehren (wer ihn nicht kennt Furor ist Guildleader der Fires of Heaven http://www.fohguild.org/ :

Basically
this whole thread is retarded and about a set of classes that mutated into something which they should have never become.

Your assumption that Paladins or Shadowknights should be 'The Master of Aggro' is about as stupid and inane as me saying Warriors should be the masters of Healing.

Stuns were never intended as aggro tools. Using a level 9 spell to lock down aggro, as NICE as it is, and believe me it's damn nice, should not be possible. A stun is meant for one purpose - TO STUN. As you level up, more efficient stuns are given to you, some with DD components, some with faster cast times, some with faster refreshes, some allowing the 'STUNNING' of higher level mobs, and some with a combination of the aforementioned purposes.

With that said, Aggro and Tanking go hand in hand. Logically a paladin should not be the master of tanking. That's my job. Given that tanking is my PRIMARY role, I should have the best tools at my disposal to perform that job. I currently do not. This is a design flaw.

I suspect that soon, the ability to generate aggro with cheap stuns (if not all stuns) and the INCREDIBLY cheap Fears will be nerfed without mercy. Mark my words, it's coming. I can basically keep aggro lock on my SK in an undead zone by chaining lvl 15 fear for 40 mana and lvl 22 Spook the Dead for 10 mana (that's right, TEN - 10 - TEN mana); at 3.5 seconds for Fear before spell haste and 2.0 seconds on the nose for spook the dead. For a grand total of 50 mana, that's enough to lock a mob on my SK until hell freezes over. If I want to be a dick, I can sick a Festering on the target and another fear and basically, GOOD LUCK getting it off me. A warrior on the other hand relies on 2 procs per minute generating 700 hate per proc. Would you like me to do the math of how utterly shitty that is? Bust out a calculator junior.

A Paladin is the defender of a group. Did you read that? THE DEFENDER OF THE GROUP. They have abilities to increase the survivability of the group greatly, far more than a Shadowknight or Warrior. On the other hand, a Shadowknight is the DPS dealer of the Knights, who has several utility spells available to also augment the DPS of the group and also other abilities (FD, self taps, snares, self only mana regen, corpse recovery, etc...). When I'm on my Shadowknight, I NEVER stop casting spells. Depending on the group, I'll be tossing Auras, a group tap, dots, DDs (something a paladin basically lacks aside from undead nukes and flame of light), etc... And admittedly, I use fear like I use air. I love it but I'm not so jaded as to not think how wrong it is that I can pull more aggro with 50 mana on my gimpy ass 120 aa'd Dread Lord than I can with my 400+ AA geared to the tooth Warrior. At the same time, I can generate sick DPS and would and do annhilate equally equipped and even better equipped Warriors than me in groups. When the fuck did this become ok?

It's not ok. Playing a Shadowknight and a Paladin and then going back to a Warrior is a sad thing. I can't even force my knights to play warriors, they'd rather just log out, and that's the ultimate test right there... the easiest way I've found to shut Knights up is to let them play a warrior. After they're done (it usually doesn't take more than 5-10 minutes of fighting) they are silent. Then I get the, "Welp, I don't know how you do it because this sucks." speech. Yea, thanks, I know it sucks. The things I can do on my GIMP SK are so ridiculous that the only time Furor ever comes out now are for raids. I have no desire to play him. My Shadowknight is 1000x more fun and worthwhile to me and the groups I'm in.

Additionally, a Paladin is JUST as awesome. For example I was pulling AE on Kreugen the other night, something I normally do on a warrior. Everything was the same. On these AE pulls if I get hit, I take a LOT of damage. On a warrior, that means run around, get to your cleric and pray for the arb to land or a heal. On Kreugen, I laugh. I get down to 20% health, within 30 seconds I have healed myself back to 80-100% with a few Lights and one SC (all 10,500 hps worth - but that's another rant entirely). The best part is that the heals I just cast on myself bought me a metric fuckton of hate so when I bring the train home to the station, those mobs dont bum rush the cleric that didn't have arb up and tossed an SL. Usually then I'll just toss a Wave of Mar or a few Lights if people are hurting. I am invincible and I like it... a lot.

There is no argument a Knight can make for any melee balancing to be pushed their way. There is no argument a Knight can use to even TALK balance to a Warrior. There is no room for negotiations. No room for anything anymore. Ironically, I don't think the melee changes they're proposing will make me drop gearing up and AA'ing my Shadowknight. A half a dozen gimmicks will never replace the unbelievable abilities and spells I have at my disposal as a Shadowknight. Basically, the melee changes they are going to propose have to be so ridiculously good (in order to put Warriors on par with SKs/Pal) that they would completely destroy what little integrity is left in the game. So I stand by my original thoughts on these changes; they will be nothing more than gimmicks that give a 2% DPS increase.

EQ is fucked.

Now kindly shut the fuck up.
__________________
I'm gonna be Iron like a Lion in Zion...

[Tarsonius]

Und noch einer:

Ein EQ Developer im Steelwarrior Forum zum Thema Fear/stuns-Spells Agro.. (Snare fand keine Erwähnung, scheinbar (ich bin da kein Spezialist) machen die meisten SKs Agro mit fear spells....

Also Fear wuerde mich wundern...oder willst du Cursed einmal durch Ssra hintherrennen? Also wenns stimmt, würds mich wundern, da nen Fear, der durchkommt, schnell nen oarges Problem werden kann Snare macht eigentlich schon massig aggro, 2 x Terror hinterher (bzw. Terror vorher beim pull) und wenn du net grad mit Fleebag nukes oder tauntest, reicht das normal.

Aber trotzdem schön, das ich bei den nächsten Raids endlich mal wieder zu wichtigen Dingen kommen...zurücklehnen, assist drücken und cocktails trinken

[Aviendha]

Cursed wird definitiv nicht feared durch Ssra rennen, da fear level capped ist (legt mich nicht fest aber ich glaube lvl 55).
Alle Mobs die über Lvl 55 sind automatisch immun gegen fear, deshalb kann man in Bot zB fear zum aggroen nutzen da mobs das eh resisten weil immun aber mega aggro macht.

[Chili]

Erläuterungen zu den Bard-Changes:

There’s a lot of misinformation going around about the changes in the next update so I thought I’d give you guys a break down of the ones that effect you.

1) Jam Fest should be fixed next patch. This has NOT CLEARED TESTING yet so if it gets pulled at the last minute I’m sorry, but right now it looks like it’s going to make it in. The one exception will be to the resist increasing songs. Their resist portions should not be increased by Jamfest, as they are already very high, and we don't feel the need an improvement.

2) The change to lull durations was a bug fix that effect any beneficial song that hit an NPC. As lull spells were tagged as beneficial, they were all lasting an inordinate amount of time. I know it’s been that way for quite a while, and I’m sorry about that it. It should have been fixed much sooner.

3) Extended Notes and Sino’s Crescendo. As I’m sure almost all of you know, it was affecting the range on PBAE songs and it’s been fixed and refunded.

4) Deftdance is NOT being nerfed, it should allow you to dodge every melee attack from the front just as it always has. In addition, Puretone and Deftdance are now on different timers, so assuming you have enough endurance, you’ll be able to use them back to back. This is true of all of the 55/60 hybrid discipline couplets.

So it’s kind of a mixed bag over all. There’s a few nerfs, and there’s a few improvements. I hope most of you can understand that we’re making these changes in order to make a better game, and that none of these changes should subvert a bards desirability in group or raid situations.

- Ryan

[Gueni]

mal schaun was das so bringt